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Considering a Montauk 17 for our family.
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| 9R |
Posted on 09/09/16 - 12:36 PM
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Would really appreciate your help. We had started looking for a new boat for our family of 5 when we stumbled across several Montauk 17's in the 1996 to 2000 year range. All with either an Evinrude or Mercury 90 2s, original to the boats.
I was familiar with Whalers but not extensively and started finding and reading what I could. The ones we are looking at have a back bench seat. We're wondering if it is two small considering the size of our family? Our oldest is a pre-teen and I want the next boat to last quite a while so it will need to fit 2 adults and 3 teenagers. It appears to have enough room, but I'm not sure.
We like to explore several bodies of water around us that are anywhere from an hour to 3 hours away varying from rivers and lakes to the coastal bay. The light tow of this boat is very appealing. We're use to more confined spaces and just want to have seating for everyone. This model and size appear to be the 'SUV' of boats which is what we're looking for.
Not looking for speed. Most of the time we are cruising and site seeing at around 7-13mph. Might have one of the kids want to try wakeboarding in the future. Rest would just be tubing whenever.
Grew up on a 16ft Mark Twain bowrider that sat 8 people comfortably so I'm hoping this isn't too small?
Thanks!
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| JRP |
Posted on 09/09/16 - 1:40 PM
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9R wrote:
Would really appreciate your help. We had started looking for a new boat for our family of 5 when we stumbled across several Montauk 17's in the 1996 to 2000 year range. All with either an Evinrude or Mercury 90 2s, original to the boats.
I was familiar with Whalers but not extensively and started finding and reading what I could. The ones we are looking at have a back bench seat. We're wondering if it is two small considering the size of our family? Our oldest is a pre-teen and I want the next boat to last quite a while so it will need to fit 2 adults and 3 teenagers. It appears to have enough room, but I'm not sure.
We like to explore several bodies of water around us that are anywhere from an hour to 3 hours away varying from rivers and lakes to the coastal bay. The light tow of this boat is very appealing. We're use to more confined spaces and just want to have seating for everyone. This model and size appear to be the 'SUV' of boats which is what we're looking for.
Not looking for speed. Most of the time we are cruising and site seeing at around 7-13mph. Might have one of the kids want to try wakeboarding in the future. Rest would just be tubing whenever.
Grew up on a 16ft Mark Twain bowrider that sat 8 people comfortably so I'm hoping this isn't too small?
Thanks!
When we began looking for a small runabout a couple years ago, the Montauk 17 and 170 models were high on our list. These are nice boats and their shallow draft with flattish bottom makes them especially well-suited for cruising in protected waters and beaching at sandbars. I say "in protected waters" because the shallow draft and flattish bottom has a downside, which is that the ride will be on the rough end of the spectrum in open water with any kind of seaway running. Also, the freeboard is fairly low too.
Then there was the size consideration. The Montauk 17 is really a 16.5' boat, with a relatively narrow beam. This definitely makes it easily trailerable and much less difficult to launch/retrieve. It also doesn't require a big tow vehicle either. On the flip side, there is not a lot of interior space, and very limited built-in storage. Plus some of that space is taken up by the on-deck fuel tank(s).
With a family size like yours, and with some prompting from knowledgeable folks here on WhalerCentral, I ended taking a closer look at the Outrage 18 models. At first it might seem the Outrage 18 is only a slight step up from the Montauk 17. But the 18 is actually 18.5' compared to the 17 at 16.5'. Plus the Outrage 18 has more than a foot of additional beam. So taken together, that makes it a much more substantial boat, size-wise. And the below-decks fuel tank doesn't use up any of that extra space, either. Additionally, design elements (such as a deeper V hull and higher freeboard) make it more suitable for rougher waters. In the end, we went this route for the extra space and capability (we purchased the final version of the classic Outrage 18, which had been re-named the Outrage 19 during the '90s.)
A downside to the Outrage 18 (and especially our 19 Outrage II version) is that it does require more tow vehicle than a Montauk 17. But most mid-size SUVs should be able to handle it. There would also be a little more muscling at the ramp to launch/retrieve it -- but still not all that tricky.
So, there are pros and cons to these two models. It's difficult to make a strong recommendation against the Montauk 17. You have a much better idea of the sort of waters you'll be operating in. I suppose my biggest argument for considerign an Outrage 18 would be space for your family, and growing room.
Also, while I don't know your budget, the Outrage 18 wouldn't be the only option for stepping up in size. The Dauntless 18/180, and the Montauk 190 would be other models to consider.
Edited by JRP on 09/09/16 - 1:42 PM |
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| 9R |
Posted on 09/09/16 - 2:30 PM
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Thank you JRP, we appreciate it.
We will be pulling the boat with a mini-van for decent distances. In addition, our budget runs in the $10-15k range. We don't head out onto the gulf side of the island and we don't venture out onto the main lake bodies if it's rough. With that, and from what you've said, I think the lean is definitely towards the Montauk 17 as long as we're comfortable in some regards.
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| Joe Kriz |
Posted on 09/09/16 - 3:06 PM
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I would consider a little bit larger boat for that many people to ride around in comfortably. Even though called 17' these other boats have more room including built-in stern quarter seats for occupants.
1990-1995 Outrage 17' I
http://www.whalercentral.com/userphot...album_id=3
1996-1999 Outrage 17' II
http://www.whalercentral.com/userphot...album_id=4
1995-1997 Dauntless 17' DC (Dual Console)
http://www.whalercentral.com/userphot...lbum_id=82
And a little jump up would be a 1998-2001 Ventura 18'
http://www.whalercentral.com/infusion...er_id=9660
Maybe even a Ventura 16' which also has built-in seating for 6
http://www.whalercentral.com/infusion...r_id=17577
And maybe others would fit your needs also?
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| 9R |
Posted on 09/09/16 - 7:15 PM
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Thank you however, with the exception to the DC, I'm not seeing the difference in seating area. the Montauks we're looking at, although shorter than the other models listed, have a back bench seat which can seat two, two at the helm and a wider double seat in front of the console for a total of 6? We'd only need it for 5. We're use to sitting close in our current 15'.
The DC would be better but there aren't any for sale even remotely close to us.
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| Harvey Boysen |
Posted on 09/09/16 - 7:29 PM
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9R
I have two Montauks.
A 1995 17 with an Evinrude 90 2 and a 2003 170 with a Merc 90 2.
Both are fantastic boats. The 170 is in South Carolina and I use it inshore and offshore and the 17 is in Texas and I use it inshore and sometimes freshwater.
The 170 is larger than the 17 and has a higher freeboard.
They both are OK for 3 for serious fishing and 5 for birdwatching, trips to the beach and just riding around.
With a family of 5 and a Montauk 17 or 170 you would have to be friendly!
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| Perichbrothers |
Posted on 09/09/16 - 9:22 PM
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It's tricky just cause there is seating doesn't mean it can actually be used.
It all depends on the engine weight, people weight, junk you bring/cooler, fuel tank location, water roughness and speed...more I'm sure...
We've got an older 16'7" custom with a back bench that nobody sits on under way. We only use it when anchored and diving or lounging. Our hull rides better with the weight more centered and there are noticeable changes with moving kids.
My wife never goes out (ok twice) so usually it's me and 3 kids and sometimes their friends. It's tight but we have fun!
If you get a chance have the family pile onto the boat you like even on the trailer. It'll be obvious if you think it's doable.
TP
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| masbama |
Posted on 09/10/16 - 8:50 AM
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We had a 1977 Montauk that we loved. Easy to tow/handle, cheap to operate, fun to run. When we had our second child we found out that it was cramped when we set out on our excursions with four humans and a bunch of stuff. We backed into a 1999 Dauntless 18 that solved our space problem but is a different animal on all other fronts. The classic Outrage 18 may be your best bet. Where are you located?
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| tedious |
Posted on 09/10/16 - 2:18 PM
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I own a Supersport 15 and have spent a good deal of time in an Outrage 18 and a 170 Montauk, and also towed and launched them all many times. I would not tow an Outrage 18 for any distance behind a minivan, but the 170 Montauk would work fine. With 2 adults and 3 kids I think the classic Montauk 17 will feel too small in a very few years, but the 170 will have more room.
The challenge with a 170 will be finding one in your budget range. It will be easy to find a Montauk 17, but it's not a bargain if it won't work for you, and in my opinion it will not. An Outrage 18 can easily be found for those prices, so is upgrading the tow vehicle and getting an 18 an option?
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| whalerlibby |
Posted on 09/10/16 - 3:08 PM
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Not to hijack the thread but on a side note what would be the consensus of the classic montauk 17 for a family of 4 with 2 adults and 2 kids (2 and 5 year olds)?
Edited by whalerlibby on 09/10/16 - 3:35 PM |
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| Joe Kriz |
Posted on 09/10/16 - 3:41 PM
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9R wrote:
Thank you however, with the exception to the DC, I'm not seeing the difference in seating area.
I guess you missed the part where I said the other Whalers have "Built-In" seating for passengers where the Montauk 17' does not.
The Montauk 17' has an option of installing a stern seat in the middle of the floor in the stern taking up valuable room in such a small boat.
You can place folding marine seats on any boat for more seating but at what cost of deck space?
2 small kids and 2 adults. OK
3 medium to large kids and 2 adults would be overcrowded in my opinion thus my recommendation for other 17' models with more room and built-in seats.
As others have mentioned and added to the list of 17's
Not sure of used prices:
Montauk 170
http://www.bostonwhaler.com/Page.aspx...ntauk.aspx
Dauntless 170
http://www.bostonwhaler.com/Page.aspx...tless.aspx
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| Perichbrothers |
Posted on 09/11/16 - 7:42 AM
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whalerlibby wrote:
Not to hijack the thread but on a side note what would be the consensus of the classic montauk 17 for a family of 4 with 2 adults and 2 kids (2 and 5 year olds)?
Perfect!
TP
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| ggalluppi |
Posted on 09/12/16 - 5:20 AM
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whalerlibby wrote:
Not to hijack the thread but on a side note what would be the consensus of the classic montauk 17 for a family of 4 with 2 adults and 2 kids (2 and 5 year olds)?
That's basically my setup, 2 adults and a 5 and 7 year old that have been on the boat since they were 3 and 5. It can be cramped at times depending on what you bring. We usually hit the local beaches and sandbars and pack 4 chairs (2 regular beach chairs and 2 foldable kids chairs), sand toys, sometimes boogie boards, etc... It's all about how you pack. I put a large soft cooler bag and dry bag for clothes inside the 94qt cooler in front of the console. The cooler bags comes off when we hit the beach. I'm also able to fit the 4 of us and 2 small kids Kayaks on. For us, it's the perfect boat. Would I like some more elbow room and some storage, yes absolutely. But, we love the versatility of being able to fish, crab, clam, and especially being able to get in skinny spots where not many other boats can go which are perfectly shallow to let the kids swim. I would like to upgrade to an 18 Outrage one day, but I think I would always hold onto the Montauk to keep it in the family. It'll be my sons boat one day...
Edited by ggalluppi on 09/12/16 - 5:21 AM |
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| 9R |
Posted on 09/12/16 - 6:19 AM
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Thanks for everyone's responses, it's truly appreciated. We went and viewed one yesterday and loved it. It was in mint condition and looked brand new. We were able to climb on board and reviewed seating arrangements. We considered the kids growing and still figured we would have room. It was slightly snug going past the console but not as bad as I had imagined. We're an active family so it may be easier for us so I could see why larger adults would complain.
I've been on friends' 19-23' CC boats for fishing excursions and with their fishing rod mounts on the side of the console plus the support bars for their T-tops taking up room, theirs felt no different in passing. If they had railings on the side of their boat, keeping you from swinging out, I think it would have felt similar. I've also been on friend's 20-21' bowriders. The seating was great and the storage way too much, but still you had to kind of get out of someones way in order for them to pass by or get to the storage compartments. It was frustrating since they were such large boats but more storage than people space. I was disappointed with the large engine that guzzled away a significant amount of fuel for such heavy displacement that wouldn't start planing until 20mph. Also experienced the large V-8 of their tow vehicle trying to pull such a weight and listened to stories of trailer brake maintenance, wood floor and carpet replacement. Just didn't fit what we want for us.
We come from a 15' Zodiac Inflatable so we're use to fitting into tight quarters. That boat is about 13' from transom forward with a 6' beam. We store everything we need back behind the last bench. It's like my '85 Jeep CJ7 with no top or doors or someone with a motorcycle. You feel more connected to the environment and scenery. We also grew up on a 16' bow rider style that seated 8. We typically had about 6-7 of us along for all day trips of skiing and site seeing. We're use to not being able to bring a lot on board so the Montauk probably had more storage space than what we need or what we're use to. I think the comparison is like someone who is accustomed to living in a tiny house vs someone who lives in a 3-bedroom house and then moves into a 1-bedroom apartment. Can be a positive for one and a negative for the other, who is the majority.
Again, we appreciate everyone's input. I think your recommendations are spot on. I think we're a rare case in which this will work. If, after a couple of years, it turns out we've out grown it, I know we won't have a problem selling it. We'll have had a great time in between though exploring rivers, lakes and the coast. We're still good with the space of the Zodiac but it's starting to be a little under-powered for us, so time to upgrade. Out of all the boats we've reviewed, besides our current boat, it was the first I've heard my wife talk positive about. We'll greatly miss heading up through the rapids of the river but we're excited for what more this boat could bring.
* forgot to mention. Researched the suggested models and found them to be very difficult to locate near us. Seemed they were all along the East Coast/South Florida or over 1k miles from us. Montauk 17s seem to be the most common and in better shape when compared to their counterparts. Wouldn't mind the 170 but have a feeling it would be years before we'd see one in this area. Maybe then might be the time for an upgrade for an extra 3-5" all around... ;)
Edited by 9R on 09/12/16 - 6:59 AM |
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| gchuba |
Posted on 09/12/16 - 8:31 AM
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I have fished quite often on Montauks. A great versatile boat. I would question 5 people on one of those hulls comfortably. 3 men fishing makes for a tight ride let alone 5 on board. My opinion, but I would go next step up for 5. Towing weight not an issue.
Garris
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| DennisVollrath |
Posted on 09/12/16 - 10:17 AM
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9R,
I think you'll be fine with 3 kids and 2 adults for the kinds of activities and speeds you describe. I owned a Montauk for a few years and loved it. We had 2 adults, 2 kids (daughter plus friend), and a cowering dog regularly on short outings and it worked fine.
If you don't pay a premium for the boat, you can always sell and upgrade later as your needs become clearer or change, and not lose much money.
Dennis
1985 Outrage 18 with Suzuki DF140A |
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| 9R |
Posted on 09/12/16 - 10:22 AM
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Thank you Dennis.
If you guys had a choice between a '90s Evinrude 90hp 2-stroke V-4 or a '00s Merc 90hp saltwater 2-stroke with the same number of hours, and your weren't biased on brand, would you have a preference?
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| DennisVollrath |
Posted on 09/12/16 - 10:36 AM
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9R,
I won't be much help on this one, as we repowered to a 70HP Yamaha 4-stroke. Repowering is probably not the route you should choose until you know the boat is right for you, and you are dissatisfied with the current power.
Dennis
1985 Outrage 18 with Suzuki DF140A |
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| 9R |
Posted on 09/12/16 - 10:38 AM
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Not looking to re-power. These two are the engines we can choose from.
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| jcdawg83 |
Posted on 09/12/16 - 10:41 AM
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I have a classic Montauk and, to be honest, I think it is way too small for a family of 5 regardless of the kid's ages. A Montauk is a great 2 man fishing boat and is OK for two couples to ride in. The lack of storage space means towels, floats, tubes, life jackets, etc all have to be stored either under the console or in the bow anchor locker or left out on deck. Montauks are open skiffs, they are not family runabouts or ski boats. The pilot seat will hold 2 people in relative comfort and the cooler in front of the console will seat 2 more in tight quarters.
For a family of 5, I would look more to a Dauntless in the 20' range.
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