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Re: 1975 Montauk 16'7"

I just had a reproduction capacity plate made for my 1975 Montauk by a reputable vendor. It is a sticker. It arrived today:

http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/a...e0a848.jpg

The data seems very strange:

Max Hp with reote steering: 100
Max hp w/o remote steering: 50
Maximum Persons Capacity (Pounds): 1154
Maximum Weight Capacity (Persons, Motor & Gear) (Pounds): 1154

The hp figures seem correct. The weight capacities seem inconsistent. 1154# seems low for people, their gear, and the motor. It also seems strange that the plate would specify the same for people only, and then include the same all-up weight.

Does anybody know what the actual figures for this boat might be?

Thanks.

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Make that a 1975 Montauk with a 16'7" hull. Sorry!

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That doesn't seem right.

Will wait to hear from other 1973-1975 Montauk owners.
Maybe they can post a photo of their capacity plate for us?
http://www.whalercentral.com/articles...icle_id=17

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The NMMA capacity plate format looks completely different than what your vendor produced. That is a very poor "reproduction".

See this is an example: http://www.whalercentral.com/photogal...photo_id=2

Since yours is wrong, I would request a refund and order the correct plate from Magic Brush. Janis, the owner, is the only authorized Whaler decal vendor and is also a whaler owner.

http://magicbrushsign.com

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We also need to keep in mind that the 17' models were not made until 1976.

Your original capacity plate should probably say 16'7" and not 17.
I cannot find any photos of the 16'7" capacity plates.
Anyone?

The 16'7" should probably look something like the photo below but 16'7" Model.

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A 16 hull has a capacity plate that reads as follows:
BOSTON WHALER INC. ROCKLAND MASS.
16'7" MODEL (WHALER LOGO)
THIS BOAT IS BUILT TO ACCOMODATE UNDER NORMAL
CONDITIONS AN OUTBOARD MOTOR OF NOT MORE THAN
100 OBO CERTIFIED HORSEPOWER AND
10 PERSONS AT 150 LBS. PER PERSON
OR PROPERLY LOCATED MAX. WEIGHT OF
2400 LBS FOR PERSONS, MOTOR, AND GEAR.
WARRANTY IS VOID IF 100 HP IS EXCEEDED

The 17 hull has a capacity plate that reads:

7 persons or 885 lbs
1415 lbs Persons, Motor, Gear
100 HP motor

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We already have the 17' models here:
http://www.whalercentral.com/photogal...photo_id=2

We just don't have a photo of the 16'7" model
Thanks for the info. Now we just need a photo from someone with a 16 model.

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I have a 1979 Newport 17 commercial hull with original plaque and I have a weight limit of 1154 lbs, is your hull a commercial hull with red dot besides the logo

Marc

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Hi Phil. I actually purchased this capacity sticker from Magic Brush, along with a new HIN plate and a set of side decals. I worked with Tom, not Janice (he answered the phone). In all fairness, I only specified my year and model number (1975 Montauk). I did not supply the hull length or a capacity plate format/ratings (frankly, I did not know what the ratings were). I remembered reading a post from Joe that these folks were the authorized suppliers for these items. I supposed I assumed they had official Whaler information on the ratings.

I will check call Tom (or Janice) and let them know I have the wrong capacity sticker. In boat terms, the cost was low: 12 bucks. I will see if they will send me the correct one at cost. I have a feeling we need to keep these folks in business!

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Joe, where would this plate have been riveted?

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Weatherly, this is great, thanks! The figures make much more sense. With your permission and that of Joe, I will send your text and Joe's photo to Magic Brush with the replacement order.

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Marc - I believe you solved the mystery of where that very strange 1154 lb number came from! Is the red dot on the capacity plate? My plate or sticker is long gone. I am going to call Boston Whaler customer service tomorrow to see if I can track down a little of the history of the boat.

Besides the weight limit, does your plate look anything like the sticker I received?

I suppose the moral of this story is that I need to do my research before placing an order and provide as much information as possible, even when dealing with an experienced vendor like Magic Brush.

By the way, Tom was very, very nice, and the service was quick. The HIN plate is a work of art, but it has to be replaced as well. The last character of my HIN is an "I" (capital I), and it was made up with the numeral 1. Again, I emailed the correct HIN to Tom but did not emphasize that the last character was a letter not a number. I am keeping my fingers crossed on the side decals!

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The red dot and in some reading the dot could be black, is on the side of the hull imbedded into gel coat close to where the logo is, it is the size of Canadian loony.

My plate which is riveted to the Inside of the hull close to the console is metal and is exactly like the one you received

Good luck in your research

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Thanks for the orientation, Marc! As I sand down the sides, I will look for the old holes so I make sure I get the new "plate" in the correct place. Magic Brush apparently doesn't do real capacity plates, only stickers. I may make my own plate and affix the sticker.

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OK, here's what I've been waiting for... Joe, the 17 art shown, and most of the plates shown, are incorrect by a mile. Mostly it has to do with all the bottom info on them, it is not cookie cutter info and not all boats have the same details, and another thing is the boat authority logo's.. The first three plates were USCG approval, then BIA/BIA, then BIA/NMMA and the NMMA/NMMA was the last, still in use. There are actually 4 different "styles" of plates and many variations from there... I have most all the original art and variations. GPJ's model, according to BW official records, is in a transition year where the plate could be a 16-7 or a 17, I debated which to send...
Either way GPJ, if you think it's wrong, why not call me back? I'm not perfect and mistakes get made, but as you say, we deal with it pretty well when wrong...
The 13 plate shown runs from about '72 to '77, along with 16'7, 19, & 21 models in the same style as shown. You guys also have to remember that the capacity numbers changed alot when they started adding "factors of safety" numbers to the mix among other regulations. We do have alum. plates for all that were 1 color, mostly models up to '77 or so, and all colors were used on plates '77 on into the 80's, right up to the normal standard of black/yellow we have today.
I do have pics of all models and variations and have verified the info with the factory if I am not sure... Point is, don't look at the plates on this site as gospel, they're not...

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Thank you Phil. GPJ, if there is a problem, please call my office,
JANIS

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Once again, I have overstepped my knowledge.

My apologies for confusing the issue further.

Just goes to show, even after 10+ years of reading all about Boston Whalers, there is a lot more to learn.

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Dear Janis - I think we have sorted out what capacity sticker goes with this hull. I should have done my research before placing the order.

Whaler Central Members - For what it is worth out there in Whaler Central land, the quality and aesthetic appearance of all three items I ordered from Magic Brush - capacity sticker, HIN plate, side stickers - is exquisite. The price was very fair. Shipping was fast and damage-free. I would not hesitate to use the company again. In fact, I plan to ask if they can make some switch labels for my instrument panel.

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Dear Tom - Thank you for your gracious reply. I am not surprised that 1975 was a transition year. More than anything, I was concerned that the text listed the same weight limit for both categories.

I will call you up to discuss options. Glen

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GPJ, any chance you may keep the plate as true factory original? 4 plates for that year, who knows which was with your hull. Especially when the archivist used for references (with factory records) is the one supplying the product. I have had some old tractors with mismatching I.D. information. I believe those old boys would have a stack of plates, use them up regardless of a particular change on the assembly line, and send them on there way. Adds character to the era.

Garris

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I used to collect/restore old IH Cub Cadet lawn tractors built right here in Louisville. If your serial number placed you at the beginning of a model year, you might have parts that you swore did not belong on your tractor. Back in the day nothing went to waste, and the guys on the line were a lot less obsessive than we have become!

After lunch I am going to phone Boston Whaler and ask them if they can tell me what plate probably went with my hull. In lieu of that, I will probably just stick with the sticker I have in hand.

Thanks for your insight, Garris.

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GPJ, your lucky you only have the plate issue. My 22' 1979 Revenge is the first full cuddy slapped on an Outrage hull. Unfortunately, the gas tank deck cover was designed for the CC and the cuddy covers a line of screws holding the deck in place. Annoying, but I love the fact that my boat was one of the first in line with an innovation.

Garris

I was an OC 3/HG Oliver man. Helped with one Cub Cadet, very cute tractor.

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True. but they are correct for the year(s) they fit.
Like you mention, there are many different plates and we try to show the correct ones that members send us.
We don't know the years and we leave that up to you.

If anyone notices the rivets on some are photos taken right from the boat and others are drawings taken from those originals for those years.
http://www.whalercentral.com/photogal...album_id=1

These are for reference and match what I had on my Whalers and in no way try to say these are good for all years.
Other years and models may vary.
I just added the Outrage 17' I and Outrage 17' II even though both of these just say they are for the 17' Outrage. Persons, capacities, etc. are different for both of these models I and II.
The Outrage I is from 1990 and the Outrage II is from a 1996 year model.
My 1997 had the same as far as I remember.
And now someone comes up with a 1999 17' Outrage III which no one can figure out including Boston Whaler.

Glad you have to keep these plates figured out and not me.
Keep up the good work.

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Joe,

Is it of value that I send you a picture of the plate on my 1979 Newport 17 commercial hull.

Regards,

Marc

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Marc.

Sure. I try and save all photos.
Can't guarantee I will post them as there are too many capacity plates as you know from reading this thread.

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Garris - That's a amazing story about your Revenge. I happen to be an engineer by trade, and sometimes production deadlines take precedence over maintainability! Hopefully that moved that parting line for the following year's production. Have you posted a photo of your boat? I'd love to see it. I'm afraid my only distinction is the Montauk with the worst owner paint job in history!

Olivers... aren't those the OTHER green tractors? There were a few of the wheeled tractors still being worked in Central Ohio when I was a teenager. I was born in Eastern Kentucky, and there were a few of the crawlers around. They were prized for their stability and ability to pull a plow up a steep slope. Restoring one - and running it - must have been a blast! Olivers and IH Cub Cadets have a lot in common: Iron and steel American icons that will outlive their designers and original owners. I still mow our yard with a 1965 Cub Cadet 100. The 10 hp Kohler still runs like new. In many ways a classic BW is a seagoing Cub Cadet... or vice versa!

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I spoke with Tom at Magic Brush this afternoon about the capacity plate. I am going to replace the sticker with a metal version of the 16'7" metal plate. I believe it will have the text Weatherly posted. I ordered it without the rivet holes. Rather than adding four extra holes to the hull, I am going to use double-sided tape to hold it in place.

Despite my begging him to at least cover his costs on the replacement capacity plate, Tom would hear nothing of it. He insisted on supplying the new plate gratis. He is even going to supply the double-sided tape! Folks, that's customer service.

I also chatted with Tom for some time about classic Boston Whalers and his career in the marine industry (I'm think it was his lunch hour: hear that, Janis?). He had some GREAT stories about the old days at BW and the Brunswick transition. This man was chief draftsman for BW. The boats we obsess over bear his indelible imprint. Heck, he met his wife in Whaler! In addition to Whaler, he worked for Newport News shipbuilding on nuclear submarines and carriers. I guess Tom has drawn it all from a 9' Squall to a 1000'+ Nimitz class carrier!

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GPJ, yes they corrected the deck issue in later models. I will have pictures at some point. I do not believe it was a deadline, just an innovation that was not thought out and some fellow said "....wait a minute guys....look at what we are blocking....". I love the human element. I prefer it over computer generated products. My teak entrance misses being square by an inch or so entering the cuddy cabin. It lets me say "good enough" on my end for restoring. It is not the Swedish Yacht built for the Nike owner. Just a reasonably priced quality boat built by Americans making a sprayed in foam/gel coat work.. I like the fact the louvered door works perfect with the miss in the framing (how perfect can you get with a spray in?).

I like this label issue. Outrage III, Euro transom, 4 labels in one year. Herodotus said "...history is contemporary...". Only the fellows on the assembly line putting the boats together really know factory original.

I must have had 25 plus of the vineyard crawlers (green and yellow) pass through my hands over the years (plus quite a few other pieces of equipment). One had an auxiliary model A transmission to gear it lower (I did the same with a Volvo transmission on one) It was easier for me to get parts for a 1940 Oliver crawler than my 1981 Takeuchi excavator 15 years ago.

Garris

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Well, Squalls were a little before me but anything Temptation on I can lay claim to... I'll try to figure out the Photo Bucket thing, (sorry, I'm pretty low-tech by choice and don't try to keep up), and post pics of all of them I have and various other stickers there may be interest for... Hopefully it will help me help you guys better.
In any case, I always enjoy talking about the history of Whaler and even some of the dirty little secrets, lol... Every company has them you know... I definitely watched the landscape change from a culture of original owner/manufacturer/"family" business environment to the corporate world and way of thinking in my 11 years with the company. Surviving all the changes and problems that came with being sold 3 times was a feat in itself, at least in my mind... It was almost like being on Game of Thrones, you never knew who's head was going to be lopped off from week to week as the company was gutted by the next in line to the throne...
OK, side-track aside, I'll figure it out and get pics posted...

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Capacity plates were required after 1972. before that date they didn't exist.

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OK fellas, here my attempt at posting these things...

http://s1377.photobucket.com/user/tom...slideshow/

Hope it works, will post more if good...

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Added a ton more to the bucket, if anything's missing or doesn't seem right, let me know... Disregard the dates, the plates are the thing...

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I have a 1977 sport hull. It has the following on the capacity plate:

Max Hp with reote steering: 100
Max hp w/o remote steering: 50
Maximum Persons Capacity (Pounds): 1154
Maximum Weight Capacity (Persons, Motor & Gear) (Pounds): 1154