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How to slow for drift fishing
Silentpardner
#21 Print Post
Posted on 08/19/14 - 11:12 AM
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It appears that several responders here in this thread do not understand what "Drift Fishing", "Mooching", and "trolling" actually means..
"Mooching" is not the same as drift fishing. Mooching requires that the boat move no faster, and in the same direction as, the current in the water being fished. This allows a fisherman to fish lines straight down from the boat with very little or no angle to the lines, although the fisherman can cast away from the boat for a position in the water body being fished... sort of like a satellite in geostationary orbit...the bait stays in the same position in the current as the boat.
Drift speed inhibitors, such as a drift sock and a sea anchor, are used to reduce or eliminate the effect of the wind from the boat drift speed. The size of the drift sock/parachute/bucket must be large enough to counter the wind effect on the boat it is used with, if it's to small, or it's pass through opening is too large, (the smaller diameter end of the sock), it won't work satisfactorily to eliminate the wind effect, but it will reduce this wind effect.
For mooching, I would assume that a fully closed sock would be desirable. This is called a sea anchor, and they have been used at sea for 1000's of years. In order to pass the USCG merchant marine exams, even at the basic levels of mate, you are required to understand this principle. The parachute that is being used by R&R above is a sea anchor, it is not a drift sock.

Drift Fishing is using the wind and currents in a body of water to move over the body of water being fished at a desired speed without using any power from an engine to achieve this. Drift fishing speed, as well as direction, is a function of both wind and current. Setting up a drift pattern that covers an area the fisherman wants to fish requires skills in boat positioning at the starting point of the drift, based on wind and current effects on the boat. Drift socks are used to assist in this control of the drift pattern and speed after the engine power is shut down, usually for stealth. Think of a wind sock as an underwater sail, working to decrease speed of a vessel using wind instead of increasing speed using the wind. The sock will resist the wind.
Drift socks are like conical tube underwater kites. The smaller the opening that water passes through during a drift pattern, the greater the effect of the reduction on the speed of the vessel's drift. If you close a drift sock all the way off, you have a sea anchor. If the sock is properly sized for the boat, when closed off completely, it will only allow the vessel to be moved by current, and wind will have no effect on the speed of the boat.

Trolling is using the vessels power to pull fishing lines/lures through a body of water behind the vessel. This imitates live baits following a boat. I have never heard of using a drift sock or bag to reduce the speed of a vessel underway while trolling until I read about this in another thread here. It seems to be absurd to me, as it would seem to directly interfere with the whole point of trolling: pulling lures from fishing rods off the stern of the boat, having a fish strike one of these lures and become hooked, and then reeling the fish to the boat and putting it on ice or in a livewell.

I would have to see this "trolling bag" thing actually work successfully, i.e., actually see a fisherman put fish into the boat without tangling lines with this apparatus, before I would recommend one of these. Frankly, from my 40 years of trolling experience perspective, I don't think this method is practical at all.

I hope these definitions of fishing methods, terminologies, and techniques help clear up this discussion, as the original poster apparently wishes to discuss "mooching" as opposed to conventional drift fishing or trolling.

You need a sea anchor to mooch.


Edited by Silentpardner on 08/19/14 - 11:29 AM
 
gchuba
#22 Print Post
Posted on 08/19/14 - 12:13 PM
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Thank you Silent. I referred to "mooching" but and was wondering what you put in the water. I am glad you defined the various socks, bags, etc... plus types of use. So it looks like Rock N Roll fabricated a Sea Anchor vs. "sock".

I am new to mooching (usually troll) but just saw lines and "bags" in the water. From a fishing standpoint I would guess that a deployed "sea anchor" might be more in the way landing a fish that goes across the bow vs. a couple of "bags" hugging the side of the hull.

Garris

 
donp
#23 Print Post
Posted on 08/19/14 - 1:21 PM
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My apologies gchuba for taking this thread on a trolling tangent. You clearly stated mooching…

FYI-I’ve been following your post regarding your Revenge. Look forward to see pictures one day.


 
wing15601
#24 Print Post
Posted on 08/19/14 - 2:42 PM
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Thank you, Silent, for that dissertation, it has cleared up a lot for me. As far as trolling bags are concerned, I guess they aren't popular in your neck of the woods but they have been used for years by Great Lakes fishermen. My Montauk 17 with the E-TEC 90 will not troll at less than three mph which is too fast for some of the fish I target in Lake Michigan. Here is one video which shows the actual use on a boat. http://youtu.be/9km9WgxyF-k. There is a wealth of information avail on the internet about this method of reducing your speed when trolling if you care to learn.


I winter in Ft. Myers and summer in St. Joseph, Michigan. It’s now about 12 years since I’ve joined this group. I gave my 1972 whaler to my daughter and sold the 17’. Bought an O’Day 28 sailboat and sailed on Lake Michigan. Yesterday I bought a 2005 130 Sport.
 
gchuba
#25 Print Post
Posted on 08/19/14 - 2:53 PM
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donp, no apologies needed. Slowing the boat for drifting, trolling, mooching, etc... are commingled. Looks like different applications for weather conditions that bend the designed use for the various methods. We did not have a bag available to us so we put the motor in reverse and mitigated. All methods useful.

Garris

 
Silentpardner
#26 Print Post
Posted on 08/19/14 - 3:51 PM
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donp, no apologies needed. Slowing the boat for drifting, trolling, mooching, etc... are commingled. Looks like different applications for weather conditions that bend the designed use for the various methods. We did not have a bag available to us so we put the motor in reverse and mitigated. All methods useful.

Garris


I agree with this 100% !!! It's all about improvising, that's how sea anchors came to be a very long time ago :)

Wing,
My Montauk 17 with the E-TEC 90 will not troll at less than three mph which is too fast for some of the fish I target in Lake Michigan.

I feel your pain there...sorta. I don't know what you are targeting specifically, but I assume Trout and Salmon? Possibly Walleye?
I have caught these species in Lake Michigan while trolling. I don't fish at all up there anymore, but 3 mph (surface) was never too fast to catch fish when I found them there. I guess, from what I read now, the fish in Lake Michigan have evolved into being a bit more fat and lazy :) More meat for the table I guess, but the ones I see pictured around the net don't look any bigger...anyway, I digress, as usual :)

Wing,
There is a wealth of information avail on the internet about this method of reducing your speed when trolling if you care to learn.


Hmmmm, actually, I hope you won't hold it against me if I do not care to learn...I am sorry. Here's why.

The fish in the gulf of Mexico, where I fish now, travel and feed at much higher speeds, apparently, than those fat, lazy, no-fightin' Lake Michigan fish :) They feed at 20-40 mph. These are the slow ones. Wahoo have actually been clocked hitting baits on the troll while travelling 55-60 mph!
The fish I target trolling now, (Wahoo, Kingfish, Tuna, Dorado, Marlin, etc), all hit lures I pull at speeds of up to 25 knots! I have actually recently invested a small fortune in heavier trolling lures and trolling weights, as well as a set of rigging needles for dead bait, just so I can troll faster!
It seems, the faster you troll, the larger the fish you are likely to attract to your bait, lure, and hook, at least here :)

Bump trolling is another technique that is used here...almost coming to a complete stop, then slamming forward with the lures in the fish...almost guaranteed hook-ups. We used to do this in Lake Michigan, as well, over deep trout and salmon with downriggers. I would lay money that you will do better like this than straight trolling there. Try it.

Y'all can have all the Salmon and Trout...and good luck slowing down. I been there done that, I like what I do now much better:)
To each his own. :)



 
gchuba
#27 Print Post
Posted on 08/20/14 - 12:32 PM
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I contacted Amish Outfitters directly. Nice folks. We decided to go with a 36" Sea Anchor/Trolling Bag for my boat vs. the Drift Bag. I do not need a slow down method because I trawl with my 9.9hp kicker motor. However, the only difference between the Sea Anchor and the Drift Bag, which they carry, is the quality of construction. The Sea Anchor (Trolling Bag just a different term for Sea Anchor, one and the same) is built to higher specs. The owner of Amish Outfitters also has a charter service (tests/uses his products) and is a great reference for helping to figure which the product best suited for your needs. Fishes out of Ohio.

Thanks all for the comments and Rock N Roll for the great pictures. I could not hold out for the correct size parachute.

Garris

 
gchuba
#28 Print Post
Posted on 08/22/14 - 2:30 PM
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Go figure! I just bought a crab pot puller used from Craig's list. The seller said bring extra money. He is out in Sebastopol (town next to me) and low and behold ....he had a parachute drift anchor, exactly like Rock N Rolls pictures for sale, among other items. Of course I bought it. He told me a bunch of fellows bought a bunch of these together. Just wondering if that is where Rock N Roll got his.

I will be comparing the two. The new one purchased is 36" (has not arrived). The chute is 72". I may have an unused anchor bag for sale. Picked up a sturgeon fishing transom board from the same fellow.

Garris

Edit: First time ever I have ever seen a drift anchor for sale at garage sale type purchase


Edited by gchuba on 08/22/14 - 2:32 PM
 
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