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Gelcoat Damage from removing motor
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| Ric232 |
Posted on 07/05/14 - 9:38 AM
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Not surprisingly, the 5200 adhesive pulled some gelcoat off my transom when I removed the motor yesterday.
1. Is 4200 the best thing to use when reinstalling the motor?
2. Is spectrum color a good product to use for the repair? There are two areas of gelcoat missing each about the size of a round drink coaster. I don't need perfection since the repair will be hidden by the motor bracket, but I want to avoid water intrusion. The fiberglass is exposed.
I'm on the road today and was able to do only a basic search. Thanks for any help.
Ric
2008 130 Sport
Merc 40hp 4-stroke |
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| Ric232 |
Posted on 07/05/14 - 10:00 AM
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I found an article about a more severe repair done by Tom W
Clark. Looks like Spectrum Color (and a Preval sprayer) is the way to go.
Ric
2008 130 Sport
Merc 40hp 4-stroke |
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| cys |
Posted on 07/05/14 - 11:05 AM
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I'm sure Preval sprayers have their proponents, but I found an inexpensive HVLP sprayer to be more effective. Northern Tool or the like has them for about 40 bucks. Also, adding Duratec to the Spectrum gel coat is an option to consider. If the repair is not going to be visible, you can also get away with brushing the gel coat as the trapped bubbles won't matter.
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| wlagarde |
Posted on 07/05/14 - 11:28 AM
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http://www.whalercentral.com/userphot...lbum_id=64
1976 Sport 15 w/ 2005 50hp Nissan 2 stroke |
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| Phil T |
Posted on 07/05/14 - 11:53 AM
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For a basic repair that will be hidden, Spectrum repair kit can be used. You might need 2 since the area is large.
Marine Tex also makes a repair kit in white.
This is a textbook example why one should never use 3M's 52 or 4200 on a boat when a basic marine sealant will do the job.
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| Ric232 |
Posted on 07/05/14 - 12:11 PM
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Phil T wrote:
For a basic repair that will be hidden, Spectrum repair kit can be used. You might need 2 since the area is large.
Marine Tex also makes a repair kit in white.
This is a textbook example why one should never use 3M's 52 or 4200 on a boat when a basic marine sealant will do the job.
Agreed. Boston Whaler used the 5200 in this case. One of my questions above is whether 4200 is suitable. I can see your answer is NO.
Ric
2008 130 Sport
Merc 40hp 4-stroke |
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| Phil T |
Posted on 07/06/14 - 7:15 AM
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Boston Whaler insists the engine bolts be sealed with a sealant according to Note #5 in upper left corner of the "Engine Installation drawing for a 2008 130 sport.
http://www.bostonwhaler.com/boat_grap...3737PM.pdf
One of three things happened:
1) Factory worker grabbed wrong tube when installing motor
2) Boat dealer worked on engine and yard guy used adhesive.
3) Prior owner did it .
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| jvz |
Posted on 07/06/14 - 7:54 AM
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Ric,
There is definitely a time & place for 5200 / 4200 - totally your call.
How deep is the "wound"? Is it just deep enough to expose the fiberglass?
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| gchuba |
Posted on 07/06/14 - 8:30 AM
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If it is a deep wide wound be wary of the underlay material you use before you gel coat over. I recently threaded "transom repair" and Finnegan brought up an interesting and important detail. The gel coat is a poly resin base and does not adhere to in place epoxies (epoxies do adhere to in place poly resins). From other posts minor hole repairs make this incidental. However, if you are repairing a wide area, best to take the material compatibility into consideration. I have existing repairs with epoxies (Splash Zone) and and am sticking with it for my hole repairs but have ordered some "System III, SB-112" which acts as a bonding primer/stick coat for poly over epoxy.
Garris
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| Ric232 |
Posted on 07/06/14 - 9:54 AM
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Phil T wrote:
Boston Whaler insists the engine bolts be sealed with a sealant according to Note #5 in upper left corner of the " Engine Installation drawing for a 2008 130 sport.
http://www.bostonwhaler.com/boat_grap...3737PM.pdf
One of three things happened:
1) Factory worker grabbed wrong tube when installing motor
2) Boat dealer worked on engine and yard guy used adhesive.
3) Prior owner did it .
Phil, thanks for looking into this. I'm the original owner.
Ric
2008 130 Sport
Merc 40hp 4-stroke |
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| Ric232 |
Posted on 07/06/14 - 10:08 AM
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When the gelcoat came off, a thin layer of resin or fiber came off under part of the gel oat. Thicker than sharp edge of a steak knife but thinner than the dull edge. Sounds like I need to post a photo. I want to make sure this repair stays in place and keeps water out, even if not cosmetically perfect.
In the meantime, does anyone know if the right gelcoat color from Spectrum is Antique White or Whaler White? I want to order it ASAP.
Ric
2008 130 Sport
Merc 40hp 4-stroke |
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| gchuba |
Posted on 07/06/14 - 10:42 AM
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Both Spectrum and Boston Whaler have the color match in their archives. I called both just for cross referencing for my 1979 Revenge (both came up with same color). Not a perfect match due to age of hull. I was sticking with Splash Zone for waterproofing because all the local boat repair folk (Sausalito waterfront) swear by it. I am not familiar with the techniques for the larger repairs for comparison.
Garris
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| jvz |
Posted on 07/06/14 - 12:38 PM
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You have an easy fix - You might also check with Mini-Craft before you order from Spectrum. The colors are never dead on...
I have compounded & buffed/color sanded..etc... it gets you pretty close, but over time the sun seems to blend it just fine.
Sounds like your repair will be hidden - If you post a pic..I can send you a pdf of the process.
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| wing15601 |
Posted on 07/06/14 - 12:44 PM
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Once the fiberglass layup of a boat is fully cured, neither epoxy nor polyester resin will form a chemical bond. Most gelcoat is a polyester resin although epoxy gelcoats are available and the only possible bond to a gelcoat repair is a mechanical bond from a roughened surface. The only possible bond in any fiberglass repair is a mechanical bond to a roughened surface. It is a fact that epoxy resin is stronger than polyester resin. Some epoxy resins form an amine blush when cured, which is easily removed with plain water. Some epoxy resins form no amine blush. Once the fiberglass layup of a boat is fully cured, neither epoxy nor polyester resin will form a chemical bond. Gelcoat is a polyester resin The only possible bond in a repair is a mechanical bond to a roughened surface. . Also some polyester resins contain a wax which forms on the surface and some do not. There is no reason not to use epoxy in a repair because it will be stronger than anything else you can use. The gelcoat finish will be a mechanical bond no matter what you use so it would seem to me that epoxy would be the material of choice. You'll get arguments and different opinions on this site so why don't you check it out on the internet. Google "gelcoat repair" and look up West System epoxy to see what they have to say about it.
Edited by wing15601 on 07/06/14 - 12:47 PM
I winter in Ft. Myers and summer in St. Joseph, Michigan. It’s now about 12 years since I’ve joined this group. I gave my 1972 whaler to my daughter and sold the 17’. Bought an O’Day 28 sailboat and sailed on Lake Michigan. Yesterday I bought a 2005 130 Sport. |
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| Phil T |
Posted on 07/07/14 - 6:31 AM
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Ric -
To be totally sure, call Whaler Customer Service to verify the gelcoat of your 2008 model.
877-294-5645
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| Ric232 |
Posted on 07/07/14 - 6:34 PM
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Phil T wrote:
Ric -
To be totally sure, call Whaler Customer Service to verify the gelcoat of your 2008 model.
877-294-5645
Done. Ordered the Whaler White today (Spectrum Color #2229).
Ric
2008 130 Sport
Merc 40hp 4-stroke |
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| Finnegan |
Posted on 07/08/14 - 4:50 PM
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I recommend clear Life Caulk or Life Seal for engine bolts.
There is a proper procedure to be followed when installing an engine to a transom, and I have seen many that are done wrong.
The bottom bolts are the most critical for sealing against water intrusion, and because of that, the lower set of bolts should ALWAYS go in from the outide, with nut on the inside, in the splashwell. This is the only way you can properly seal the hole. The top bolts should go in from the inside, with nut on the engine side.
Proper installation involves putting the bottom bolts all the way throught the engine holes, and then applying the caulking to the NON-THREADED portion of the bolt shank. The top bolts, with washer installed, should have the shanks coated in caulking (but not the threads) before fully inserting into the boat. Then a ring of caulk is applied around the exposed bolt on the ouside.
To install the engine, someone has to hold the bottom bolts in place against the engine and someone has to hold the top bolts in place against the inner boat transom. The engine is then slid on to the upper bolts while the bottom bolts are pushed into the hull. Once the bottom botls are through the transom, a ring of caulking goes around the bolt before the washer and nut are installed. If done correctly, this will give you a totally waterproof installation, keeping your transom dry.
When bottom bolts are installed from the inside, there is no way a good seal can be achieved between the bolt and the wood in the transom.
To avoid galling (nylock nut locked and frozen on threads), fine thread 1/2" bolts should always be used, with brass nylock nuts. All Mercs come with this type of bolt set, and are avaiable in various lenghts from Mercury. If you must use boat store conventional coarse thread bolts with SS nylock nuts, be sure to put grease on the inside of the nut before installing.
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| wlagarde |
Posted on 07/08/14 - 6:08 PM
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Finnegan wrote:
...the lower set of bolts should ALWAYS go in from the outide, with nut on the inside, in the splashwell. This is the only way you can properly seal the hole...
...When bottom bolts are installed from the inside, there is no way a good seal can be achieved between the bolt and the wood in the transom...
I do not agree.
Edited by wlagarde on 07/08/14 - 6:08 PM
1976 Sport 15 w/ 2005 50hp Nissan 2 stroke |
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| Ric232 |
Posted on 07/14/14 - 6:36 PM
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My gelcoat repair is in process and going well. I will post pics later.
Question: When I remount the motor, what if I just cover the backside of the motor bracket with wax paper or clear packing tape so that any sealant (not 5200 this time) that oozes out of the holes will not touch the bracket? If I remove the motor in the future, shouldn't the sealant be stuck to the tape or wax paper but not the motor bracket?
Ric
2008 130 Sport
Merc 40hp 4-stroke |
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| Phil T |
Posted on 07/15/14 - 9:01 AM
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I don't think it is necessary.
Sealant has medium adhesion whereas adhesive has a bonding adhesion. Any sealant will come off the bracket on removal.
You may want to mask off the area to catch any oosing, making a clean appearance. Any painters tape works without leaving a residue.
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